Daily Kos

FAIR CRITICISM or SOUR GRAPES?

by n69n

Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:18:05 AM PDT

cspan topic: "is paul o'neils book FAIR CRITICISM or SOUR GRAPES?"

 i'm sure there will be some great calls!

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  •  admin officials: nobody listened to him (4.00 / 3)

    administration officials: nobody listened to him then, why should they listen to him now?

    repub caller says that its part of a Liberal Conspiracy.

    another repub caller says it is fair, constructive critiscism, & that he wishes Dole had won.

    excerpt from book: "cheney said "reagan proved deficiets don't matter!"

     maybe i should move this to the diaries.

    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:19:40 AM PDT

  •  drinkin wine, eatin cheese, havin anal sex! (none / 1)

    repub caller: "o'neil was gallivantin all over the world with that rock star bono, instead of bein here workin on the economy!
     they were running all over the world, africa, europe, drinkin wine, eatin cheese, havin anal sex!"

     YES the caller really said that!

    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:22:03 AM PDT

  •  repub caller: its so many sour grapes (none / 1)

    repub caller: "its so many sour grapes its beginning to saound like whine!"

    repub caller feels like o'neil is violating a confidentiality agreement.

    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:24:01 AM PDT

  •  Could be both (4.00 / 2)

    I would guess that O'Neill doesn't have that many sour grapes over being fired. As I recall he had a decent life before getting the job and has a decent life now. He didn't need it in the first place. Plus he simply doesn't seem that sour!

    There's no credible way, though, that they're going to be successful in chalking up all his assertions as sour grapes. It just can't be. They have the ring of truth to them. Even if somewhere in there you could poke around, if you were the Bushes, and find some little thing that wasn't exactly right, it all can't be reduced to nothing so easily. Where there's smoke there's fire, at least.

    This White House would have us believe that they would never ever do anything wrong. Right there they're lying! There's absolutely nothing in any of O'Neill's comments that I've seen so far that seems beyond what I would've guessed myself. How dumb do you have to be to fail to see that Bush is basically a dumb guy? He may have some leadership qualities, ability to knock heads, and all the rest. But Brainiac he ain't.

    Then we have all the history of Cheney, Rumsfeld, Powell, Rice, all the lies of 2002 that are so memorable. I can't believe they were scrupulously honest in 2001 and simply turned into baldfaced liars in 2002. There's nothing truthful about these people, and that's the truth.

    And lastly, we've had other reports of neocon schemes even during the Clinton administration to go after Iraq. Obviously with an easy mark like Bush starting in January 2001, they would have a better chance of getting their way. And they did!

    by NegSpin on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:26:33 AM PDT

  •  repub caller:he might catch something (none / 1)

    repub caller: "i was afraid when he wa hanging out with bono that he might catch something - & he obviously did!"
    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:27:09 AM PDT

  •  "YOU are one of the changes." (none / 1)

    cheney fired o'neil...& asked o'neil to announce that it was HIS CHOICE!

     cheney: the president has decided to make some changes in his economic plan...& YOU are one of the changes."

    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:34:08 AM PDT

  •  "an extremely unloyal man" (none / 1)

    repub caller: "an extremely unloyal man, but the president made a mistake in ever appointing him!"
    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:39:36 AM PDT

  •  "this president is a compulsive liar!" (none / 1)

    dem caller:"this president is a compulsive liar! this president has lied about everything from john mccain on!"

     admin officials: "laughable!"

    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:43:32 AM PDT

  •  Thanks (none / 1)

    Thanks for alerting us to the call-in.  Very interesting remarks this morning.

    Give to the Daily KOS 8!

    by Aaron Gillies on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:44:40 AM PDT

  •  "libya sumpthin sumpthin" (none / 0)

    repub caller: "sour grapes! bush is doing a great job! libya sumpthin sumpthin because president bush is a great man!"
    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:47:09 AM PDT

    •  Yeah (4.00 / 2)

      My guess:  That guy was just reading talking points from this morning's memo from the RNC.  Not even relevant to the discussion.  But we'll hear it later on today from Rush Limbaugh, David Brooks, William Safire, the Wall St. Journal Editorial page, etc., etc., etc.

      Today must be, "Oh, yeah?  But Libya, blah, blah, blah" day.

      Give to the Daily KOS 8!

      by Aaron Gillies on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:49:36 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  paid operatives (4.00 / 2)

        its been very interesting learning who are the paid operatives.
         the repubs have a lot of people who call in & just read from cal thomas columns, pretending its their own words.
        www.nornsisland.com

        by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:53:06 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

  •  Endorsement? (4.00 / 2)

    Any chance the DNC could work on having O'Niel endorse the Democratic nominee? That would have to be a first - a president's own treasury secretary appointment endorsing his opponent!

    Strateg(er)y for Du(DEM)mies

    by daunte on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:49:30 AM PDT

  •  Can't even do it anymore.... (4.00 / 2)

    I can't listen to callers to C-SPAN. It just pisses me off at how dumb some Americans are.

    "How do you ask a man to be the last to die for a mistake?" -John Kerry, 1971 but what we needed to hear in 2003/2004

    by Demise on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:50:14 AM PDT

  •  'tell *them,* not the whole world!" (none / 1)

    repub caller: "if you are part of an administration, & you have a criticism, tell them, not the whole world!"
    www.nornsisland.com

    by n69n on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 09:50:41 AM PDT

  •  Tip of the Iceberg (4.00 / 2)

    O'Neill is only one of many, disgruntled old-school Republican conservatives disenchanted by the Bush Administration's reckless financial management and foreign policy adventurism.

    While the new yahoos on C-SPAN blather, many of the ol' Club Members are quietly having serious doubts about the direction our country has taken, and will read this book with great interest - because it comes from one of their own.

    So keep it up Rove. The more the Bushies slam O'Neill for telling the truth, even more betrayed the rest of the old guard will feel.

    "The Owl that calls upon the Night,
    Speaks the Unbeliever's fright." - William Blake

    by Night Owl on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 10:56:05 AM PDT

  •  O'Neill: Bush planned Iraq invasion before 9/11 (none / 1)

    On the front page of their web site right now cnn has "O'Neill: Bush planned Iraq invasion before 9/11"

    It may be one of the more damning things in his book
    "CNN) -- The Bush administration began planning to use U.S. troops to invade Iraq within days after the former Texas governor entered the White House three years ago, former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill told CBS News' 60 Minutes."

    So how much more proof do people need.

    "It was all about finding a way to do it. That was the tone of it. The president saying 'Go find me a way to do this,'" O'Neill said.

    by mickey on Sun Jan 11, 2004 at 11:11:40 AM PDT

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